[candycornsnake]

I joined this site several months ago while looking for Basset breeders. I actually found a good one, and a great pup who is growing up well. However I have some questions that perhaps only basset owners can help with.
Katie Bug is 7 months old. She has been spayed and is doing well. She is a ball of energy still. LOL! And here I thought bassets were lazy. OH no...not her!
I signed her up for an obediance class, but we have had a lot of canceled classes due to snow. But one of the biggest obsticles to me is the trainer. First she said Katie was sure to be the class clown, based only on her breed. Then when I was struggling in class to get her attention...the teacher told me to just be patient, bassets were slower than other breeds. To not expect as much.
Our 1 year old Chihuahua is in the same class and is excelling. He has sit, down, give me your paw, all down cold. We are using the same methods...but Katie is definatly not getting it as well.
She can sit on command. But "come" is not good. She won't lay down and only will pay attention to me in class for about 20 mins tops. We have not even started to leash train them in class yet. I am just working hard on "watch me".
Food is a focus...but she loses that focus pretty quickly. I basically end up stuffing her face all class to get her to just sit with me.
The class is using clicker training...but so far there is no sign that she is understanding the clicker. It is also using a buckle collar.

So I guess what I need to know is well...what methods seem to work with your hounds? She is a theft and will pick things up of endtables and coffee tables and take off and chew it. She jumps on people to get food and barks at my other dogs if they have anything at all she wants.

Nothing seems to affect her. Tethering just makes her whine and pull and bark and trip me up. And with the other dogs trying to play with her while she is tethered...that is no good.
Yelling is useless.
Rewarding postive behavior doesn't seem to be remembered later. So it has not affected her at all.
It's as though treats or praises are windfalls from heaven, not a effect to her behaviors at all.

I bought some agility equiptment to try and get some energy out and she loves the jump (see photo) and tunnel. She is crate trained and only goes in while my partner is at work. From 7 am to noon. And then from 1 to 3. Otherwise we have been confining them to one room. (housebreaking was an issue but has been much better *knock on wood* over the past month with her and the Chi)

Anyway...sorry for the long post. Just want some ideas on what works. How did you train your basset. Do I just need to stick with it? Or are there other methods that work better?

And here are some fun photos to show off my beauty queen. She is a tiny 31 pounds btw!

 

[gsally]

Katie Bug is beautiful!

I won't be much help. My basset trained me! I think the key is persistance, whoever excels in that area wins out! Just like with kids, each one is different and you have to find a motivator that works!

Good Luck!

Post more pictures.............she is really cute!

By the way.........I'd give you an A..........for effort!

 

[candycornsnake]

LOL thanks gsally. She certainly is absolutely beautiful to me!

 

[mhvonalmen8908]

She is an absolute doll! I love her face as she's jumping! She makes it looks like she's not having a blast. And all the toys!!! No shortage of fun there!

I've got a basset/redbone mix and he picked up on the clicker training really quickly. He's also got more of an attention span than my basset. Granted, he's over a year old and she's only 7 months old. But the clicker training has worked thus far with mine. Except on walks. With both of them the reward is the walk continuing so I basically just click when they're where I want them to be and then just keep on walking. In all other training though the more treats they can get the better.

Just be persistent. Bassets are stubborn when they want to be. You just have to be more stubborn!! Good luck!

 

[Soundtrack]

What kind of treats are you using? I'd suggest that whatever it is, it's not high value enough for Katie to find them more interesting than whatever else is going on in class. And are you feeding her before class? That is a common mistake - a recently fed dog is less likely to be motivated by more food.
You might want to start the Nothing In Life Is Free program. This will give her the idea that the desirable things in life are NOT manna from heaven.
Down is a difficult one for Bassets. What worked with Leila is I sat on the ground with one leg forming an arc that I lured her under. To go under she had to lie down, so as soon as she hit the ground she got a click/treat.

I like to randomly reward attention in class. That means I keep an eye on my dog, and if she happens to look at me she gets a click/treat. Usually by the end of the set of classes I have a dog that doesn't want to take her eyes off me.

She should NOT be jumping that high at that age - one or two inches at most. She is still growing and you can damage her bones and joints with jumping. Mine don't start jump work until they are at least 18 months, more if they have a heavy build.

 

[Annie714]

Annie turned 6 in December...just TODAY she actually sat for her food. I must admit though, her lack of training is my fault. But we started working on "sit" yesterday on a walk, I would randomly stop, take a small treat from my pocket and ask her to sit. She was up on her back legs as per usual but I didn't give her the treat until she actually sat, then she got the treat and a big emotional scene out on a busy street from her momma LOL. I did that 4 times on our walk yesterday and then the same again today. I know if I keep at it, she will get it.

So basically, like others have said, you have to be more stubborn and persistent than your little Katie Bug.

 

[roscolaylamommy]

Soundtrack is right on with their suggestions. Keep in mind that bassets are notoriously stubborn and many are only willing to please their owners if it pleases themselves. It took our dog Rosco about 6-7 months before he really caught on to sit and shake. Once he started getting those down the other came along a little faster. With Layla it took a lot longer for her to catch on (she was 1 1/2 when we got her). She is still VERY stubborn about doing tricks and will only do them if there is a treat involved and there are times when we have to tap her leg to get her to shake.

Mike T would also be excellent to ask about basset training. I would send him a private message if he doesn't respond to this thread. He's made several helpful suggestions to us when we first started training our dogs. One of the best recommendations he made was to use a special kind of harness called a sporn harness for leash training. Amazon.com: sporn harness
This is by far the best harness we've used. It's designed to keep them from pulling. Harnesses work best for bassets as a regular collar and leash set up can cause neck problems down the line if your basset pulls too much.

 

[bubbad]

YUP,sounds just like a basset puppy to me.

 

[Mikey T]

but so far there is no sign that she is understanding the clicker. It is also using a buckle collar

If she in not looking or expecting a treat after a click the she does not understand the meaning. How it meaning mean taught. I find that many trainers have their student try to give meaning to the clicker by having the dog perform a task it already knows. This often fails because the dog instead of associate the click with the reward simply associated complying with the cue as the reason for the reward. I thing free shaping exercises like 101 things to do with a box is a better method because the dogs behavior is differen each time a click/treat occurs it is much more readily appearent to the dog that click=treat. The clicker is a very fine an percise tool when used well and correctly. Actual unless precision is require ie formal obedience or when free shaping a clicker is actual more of a hinder than a help and using it in less percise manner actual diminishes it effectiveness. You will find more experinced clicker trainer are very delibrate in when they use it.

Food is a focus...but she loses that focus pretty quickly. I basically end up stuffing her face all class to get her to just sit with me.

Nothing wrong with that you want a high rate of reinforcement for a behavior. The question tho is food the reward for the behavior or has it become a bribe or a lure that is never faded? see Rewards, Lures & Bribes

What kind of treats are you using? I'd suggest that whatever it is, it's not high value enough for Katie to find them more interesting than whatever else is going on in class. And are you feeding her before class? That is a common mistake - a recently fed dog is less likely to be motivated by more food.

With a highly food motivated dog the same thing can happen because the food becomes the distraction. In a highly disctrated or arroused state very little learning actually takes place. (one of the problems with lures and why they need to be faded as quickly as possible] see
Self Control and Overstimulation

Emotional reactions originate in the limbic part of the brain, which allows for fast-acting response to events based on quick impressions. Survival depends on quickness of response — allowing you to notice and duck when you catch a glimpse of a fast-moving object about to fall on your head.

Limbic over-rides cognitive. When an animal is in a state of adrenalin arousal from fear, defense, excitement or just plain sensory overload, he not only doesn't listen, he can't hear you. It does no good to repeat "sit sit sit" to a dog who is on emotional overload. He isn't thinking, he is simply reacting to the stimuli around him. He must tune-in and re-connect with you before he will be able to hear what you have to say. You must be able to get his attention first, before you tell him what you would like him to do.

For the highly food motivated dog the prescence of food can be over-stimulating One of the things you need to teach such dogs is self control in the presence of food
see

She should NOT be jumping that high at that age - one or two inches at most.

general rule of thumb 4" or the height of the elbow which ever is less before all growth plates are closed ~12 months of age.

Rewarding postive behavior doesn't seem to be remembered later. So it has not affected her at all.
It's as though treats or praises are windfalls from heaven, not a effect to her behaviors at all.

Which would be the case if she is overstimulated by food. you need to work on self control in the presence of food. see the video link.

only will pay attention to me in class for about 20 mins tops.

that is the problem with class especial for newbie dogs. Even 20 minutes is way to long to expect the dog to maintain focus. Training should occur if frequite 3-5 minute sessions with a high rate of reward ie no less than 2 reward per minute better is 5 to 10. It is why i take a crate to agility class is allows the dog to be unsupervised and not paying attention to me. You need to work withing the limits of the dogs attention span. Over time you can lengthen it but trying to force attention just doesn't work. When you have a dog that choses not to work that is fine it can go into its crate and recieve no attention /reward etc for a few minutes. Then try again latter.

One of the best recommendations he made was to use a special kind of harness called a sporn harness for leash training

Show up with one of those at a "clicker" class you'll get thrown out. For the average person however I think it is more intuitive and likely to get results than the be a tree and other loose leash training methods especial with an older dog that already has a reinforcement history for pulling

Katie Bug is 7 months old ...Our 1 year old Chihuahua

here I think is the basic problem the chihuahua so much better why. First it is older but more importantly much more mature. Small dogs mature much faster than larger ones. so a two year old chi is like a 1 1/2 - 2 year old basset when it comes to maturity. You need to keep that in mind. with the basset you are dealing with the equivelent of a 12 year old and the chi a 20 something really not a comparison at when it comes to maturity even thou ther is only a three month age difference,


FWIW the age of the basset though the traditional time obedence training class accept enrollment is the most difficult age to start training. Actual begin earlier is a much easier to esstablish a foundation and a bit a self control that makes managing the adolescent dog much easier.

also see

Simple Questions, Simple Answers

Hard to Train/

Leadership Basics

The other problem behavior you mention Jumping up. stealing etc can all come under the general catagory of lack of impulse control. Just as the video above impulse control is one of the basic things that makes a dog easy to live with.

Guidelines for Teaching Self Control

Impulse Control

Lowering Arousal

Any Dog Can Live Calmly in a House - Even Yours!

Relaxation Protocol


Rewarding Non-behavior