[willatat2]

Hi!
Is there anyone out there who is non-medicalized in the care of their basset? I would really love to get some email friends around this subject.
I am a home birth non-immunizing Mom & now grandma & I am certainly not being medicalized with my dog. I make my own food for her & my own cleaning stuff. If there is anyone out there please email me directly. I got a skinny, bloated, hyper 3 month old puppy for free & now I have a healthy, happy& pleasant 5 month old pup. I am determined to have the healthiest basset around & would love to hear from others with the same goal and taking the same path.

 

[Barbara Winters]

What is your definition of "non-medicalized" care of your basset? I believe the care of my animals health, including, prevention, maintenance and treatment should be based on evidenced based veterinary medicine. Infectious disease in dogs is a real health concern and follow the guidelines recommended by my veterinarian based on recently published studies and recommendations made by task forces (including the AAFP/AFM Advisory Panel on Feline Vaccines, AAHA Canine Vaccine Task Force, and the AVMA Council on Biologic and Therapeutic Agents).

I'm glad you have had success with a home made diet but I personally wouldn't feed a homemade diet unless a veterinarian who specializes in animal nutrition prescribed a detailed diet for my dog.

There are forums and groups that specifically deal with the issues you wish to discuss. I would suggest you and anyone else interested join one of those groups. Go to Yahoo Groups and search using phrases like "dogs feeding" and "pets vaccinations"

 

[Sandy and Bo]

I understand what you are trying to do, my mother in law feels the same way. She never had any of her kids vaccinated. That's fine. But I told her she's lucky that almost everyone else DID, because then the diseases like polio, etc, were eradicated, and that's why her kids didn't get them. (MY humble unsolicited opinion )

I had a 7 month old basset puppy several years ago. I DELAYED getting his shots, thinking another month didn't really matter. Then he got Parvo! It was heart breaking. It was a violent illness, his little body was worn out. But after spending a few hundred dollars at the vet, he made it. Most pups with parvo aren't so lucky. I couldn't have felt worse, I am older and wiser, and would never let another animal go thru such a thing again.

I'm glad your puppy is healthy, and I'm sure you love him to pieces, but there are canine diseases that vaccinations can prevent. And if he did get Parvo, no home remedy will cure it. It can kill them in just a couple of days. I realize this won't change your mind, but I just had to reply.

Sandy

 

[Betsy Iole]

If I had a nickle for every baby and little kid I've had to culture for pertussis (whooping cough) in the past couple of years.... :roll:

I don't think I had one request for a pertussis culture in my first 10 years of practice, and now it's baaaaack.

 

[biscuit]

i actually just watched a couple of films on supposedly non-medical treatment of disease.

the first was on Tibetan medicine. Tibetan medical practitioners are called doctors and work *in conjunction* with allopathic, or western, doctors. in addition, they specifically state their desire that Tibetan formulations and practices be tested by western science (which they have been and are), and that Tibetan medicine become an adjunct to western medicine --- not a replacement.

these kinds of views were expressed not only by the doctors themselves, but by the Dalai Lama.

the second film was on Ayerveda (sp. ???). same thing there. ancient practitioners, i mean positively ancient people, the most revered practitioners in India, openly stated their approval of western medicine and the importance of --- well, of basically not killing the good for the sake of the perfect. because there is no such thing as perfect. they want to work in conjunction with western doctors.

i also know native american medicine men who are perfectly happy to send their patients to hospitals, doctors, etc. one such fellow is best friends with a doctor and his wife is being treated for a chronic disease by a doctor.

iow, the people actually practicing the things from which the popular herbalist-naturalist-etc. movement is derived are themselves advocates of western medicine and medical practices.

without vaccines, people would still be hiding in their houses every summer from the waves of polio spreading across the country.

a huge number of dogs (and cats) would still be dying from distemper.

people and their critters would be succumbing to infectious diseases we don't even remember the names of anymore.

juvenile diabetes would be an automatic sentence to death at a very young age and in the most painful of ways

 

[Stephn]

I think it is very dangerous not to get rabies, and distemper shots. When I was young around 10 years old we had a cat that had distemper it was horrible sides burst open he actually survived. Back then the cats weren't vacinated in fact I don't think it is a law there to have them vacinated still. But in most places I don't know where it isn't required by law that dogs have their rabies shot.

 

[willatat2]

Well that is how I've always lived & raised my kids & pets & it has worked for us- no one ever got sick- quite the opposite! My peditricians & vets have always enjoyed seeing my healthy kids & pets-I am just looking for others to talk with about these things.

 

[Soundtrack]

You would probably like the Natural Basset Yahoo group. http://groups.yahoo.com/group/NaturalBasset/

Although I do believe that we are OVER-medicalized (drugs for things that are not diseases, or that can be better taken care of through lifestyle), I am not about to chuck modern medicine entirely. Sometimes you DO need vaccinations, antibiotics etc.

 

[barblkr]

willatat; I understand your point of view and I really admire you for making your own dog food and cleaning supplies. I do agree that many humans are over 'medicalized' or over-medicated, however, some medicines are good and necessary. And I just gotta say something about rabies vaccinations.

Rabies is a *fatal* disease that can be transmitted to you or your pet by contact with rabid animals. It can be found in any part of the world, at any time, in just about any mammal. Left untreated, even humans can succumb to rabies. It is a public heath concern. Many communities insist and enforce rabies vaccination laws. If your dog tangles with an infected wild animal, and becomes infected, what will you do?

Basically, your decision to not vaccinate your pet may not affect only you and your pet. God forbid that he or she is ever infected by a rabid animal, but if that happened and he or she bit you or one of your grandchilden, how would you handle that? What would you do? To me, that's very frightening. In the case of infectious disease such as rabies, it's worth the vaccination.

Please research thoroughly distemper, parvo, heartworm, and rabies. Check for diseases which are transmittable to humans, like rabies. All are devastating diseases for the animal and humans who love them.

Best wishes and good luck! I do wish you the best, even if we may not quite see eye to eye.

BarbR

 

[Barbara Winters]

As we discussed on another thread, rabies vaccination is required by law in all states. If an unvaccinated animal bites someone, depending on state law it may be euthanized or quarantined for 6 months. In some states it has to be a certified quarantine facility, where you'd have to pay the boarding and other fees. As mentioned in another post an unvaccinated animal who receives an unwitnessed bite or abcess is required to be quarantined for 6 months in Massachusetts.

Until last year no one has ever survived rabies!!!! But a lucky young girl last year become the first. See Only known unvaccinated rabies survivor thrives

 

[willatat2]

Thanks for the Natural Bassets tip! I have applied to join- I alway get my animals a rabies I just don't do yearly boosters- and of course they get the minimun shots so they can go in & be neutered. I am just a beliver in using natural methods rather than the modern ones- [/b]

 

[Betsy Iole]

Originally posted by willatat2
Thanks for the Natural Bassets tip! I have applied to join- I alway get my animals a rabies I just don't do yearly boosters- and of course they get the minimun shots so they can go in & be neutered. I am just a beliver in using natural methods rather than the modern ones-   [/b]

Such as...?

They'll continue to need immunizations if they enroll in any sort of training class--responsible trainers don't enroll unvaccinated dogs.

Many veterinarians have switched to boosters every three years, instead of annually. This change amounts to a large scale experiment using America's pets as its subjects. I personally won't be switching from a schedule of annual vaccinations (which we *know* prevents disease due to decades of empirical evidence), until there is a comparable amount of evidence from the current experiment.

 

[Elmer-n-Button]

Vaccines

.

She never had any of her kids vaccinated. That's fine. But I told her she's lucky that almost everyone else DID, because then the diseases like polio, etc, were eradicated, and that's why her kids didn't get them. (MY humble unsolicited opinion  

)

THANK YOU-- YOU SAID A MOUTHFUL!!! The respnsible people who "follow the rules" always end up benefiting those who follow their own rules". Just my humble unsolicitated opinion as well!)

 

[willatat2]

FYI- when my daughter was in 1st grade they had a measles epidemic at her school- the only kids who got them were immunized, not one of the non-immunized kids contracted them.
BYE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

[Rosie'sMom1]

This is one of the most ridiculous discussions I've read.

Part of the reason people (and PETS) live longer, healthier lives than ever before is due to modern medical advances. A century ago, enormous numbers of people were incapacitated by polio. When was the last case of polio you heard of in this country? Long ago, due to immunizations. Polio is still rampant in other countries where the vaccine is not as prevalent. People like this will say they want to live "naturally" like people did a century ago, but the second they get seriously ill, I believe most of them will be in the emergency room demanding treatment. It is probably true that in some instances we are "over-medicalized", but vaccinations SAVE LIVES and prevent much suffering.

People like this put their children (and obviously pets) at risk and are irresponsible.

I do not believe for one second that the children did not catch the measles because they were not immunized. If they didn't catch it, they were incredibly fortunate.

 

[Elmer-n-Button]

No need to become hostile . . . I was just agreeing with the majority of our members that scientifically, medicine has eradicated the spread of diseases that long plagued mankind, and animals. Don't get me wrong--we stay off of unnecessary medications, but I'm not about to reinvent the wheel for the sake of purist idealism. Personally, I'm not willing to place myself, my family or pets at unnecessary risk, and if that makes me "pro-medicinal" (or whatever) then so be it. I am particularly in agreement with Biscuit's post regarding distemper, diabetes and the like. One would only need to refer to their middle school history books to look up The Dark Ages, the Plagues, etc. to appreciate the value of vaccines in general, and of medicinal benefits. I worked in the school system for ten years, and saw many cases of people making non-medicative choices for their children. I did not notice these children either having an increased or decreased instance of childhood diseases, but it would make an interesting study, I suppose. The main thing is that you are satisfied with your choice, and that you recognize that (a) it is a choice and (B) it can be controversial, and so when you go out asking for opinions, you're likely to get them! :shock: Since we are the stewards for animals, who can't make these choices for themselves, I suppose that I will stick with the proven. (That & I don't have time to manufacture dog food! )

Enjoy your bassett--he sounds lucky and wonderful!

 

[joanr]

Here in MI., you get the rabies shot and tag. Then you take the tag with you to buy a license. It is the law that the dog have both a shot and license tag. If A dog bit Hap who didn't have a rabies shot I'd be so flippen mad! And if a dog without his booster bit a kid, watch out!
Joan

 

[Betsy Iole]

Originally posted by Elmer-n-Button
I worked in the school system for ten years, and saw many cases of people making non-medicative choices for their children.  I did not notice these children either having an increased or decreased instance of childhood diseases

This is due to herd immunity. As long as herd immunity stays above a certain level, those who don't vaccinate won't experience the consequences. They do need to recognize, however, that their rear ends are being covered by the rest of us who do the socially responsible thing and immunize.

 

[Mikey T]

I personally won't be switching from a schedule of annual vaccinations (which we *know* prevents disease due to decades of empirical evidence), until there is a comparable amount of evidence from the current experiment.

! assume this is given no adverse reaction of the dogs to vaccine. Seeing and push and studies done to date are in large part due to increase or at least increasing awarness of a small minority of dog and cats that can have anywhere from mild to lifethreatening reaction to shots.


FWIW at least in Massachuesetts it is possible to ge a waver on the rabies vaccines. It must be signed off by a vet and be for limited medical reasons. The dog is also to be confined indoors only.

Also of not some vaccines have been proven useless like corona virus. Other for bacterial infections like lyme disease and lyptosprorisis should be limit to area of high risk. and even then most evidence indicates that that the vaccines are actual not effect for an entire year.

Like anything in life there are advantage and disadvantages to any protocol it is best to educate your self and consult a medical professional that you trust to do what is individual best for your pets which is likely to be different than someone else that lives in a different region with a different lifestyle.

 

[Betsy Iole]

One of my cats died of feline vaccine-associated sarcoma; I am more familiar than most with the adverse effects of vaccines. I've reviewed the available evidence, I'm a medical professional, and I've discussed this topic with my vets, of course. I've made what I feel is the best decision for my dogs.

Others may arrive at different decisions. For the sake of the 3 year protocol, I hope they do. :twisted: I look forward to reviewing the evidence generated by their decision.