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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
I'm so excited, I just had to share it. I know, such a little thing. I was going to post last night until my husband started making fun of me for getting on the computer so late just to brag on my Molly.:rolleyes:

so after a few weeks of trying to get her to "down", taking everyone's advice here, doing a lot of clicker "capturing"... I was doing a mini review session with her last night before bedtime and when I did the hand signal for down, she did it! Jackpot treats for her! Back up to sit, then down again... she did it again! I did this about a dozen times, my Molly baby was like a little jack-in-the-box or something, up down, up down.
Then I had my husband do it a few times. she was a little more hesitant to down for him, but did it eventually, a few times.

So is now the time to add the verbal command? Or continue with just hand signal for awhile?
Thanks so much for everyone's help a few weeks ago! I'm so proud of my Molly! :D
 

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So is now the time to add the verbal command? Or continue with just hand signal for awhile?
some things to think about.

1. Why a verbal command at all ?
Most dogs are much better at physi al cues and verbal cues you only need a verbal cue for time you need tu cue the dog and they can not see you. Or when there can be confict between the physical cue and what you want the dog to do.
In which case you must seperate the verbal cue from the physical cue which is a lot of work

2. When most people add a verbal cue it is used inconjuction with a physical cue. This weekens both because the dog learns that both cues must occur using only one or the other results in a confused dog.

3. if you simply want a verbal cue that fine most people are more at ease with verbal than physical cues however it means spend a lot of additional time training something that may not be necessary and could be spent more productively else where only you can decide how important it is to you and your situation.

when to add the verbal Cue I woule not work on the verbal cue until the dog is profiecient ie greater than 80% of the time act on the cue in, 1 a timely manner, in all situations. Does the dog respond to the down cue out side, under distraction etc.

see How to Add the Cue

[FONT=Comic Sans MS, Arial, sans-serif]Of course, this doesn't even begin to cover how to teach your dog that the cue is the ONLY discriminative stimulus. But that's another story and will be told another time.


Decreasing Latency Latency [/url]

Clicking for Quickness



[url=http://www.clickersolutions.com/articles/2002/workingreliability.htm]Achieving Working Reliability Amidst Distractions


When to Add the Cue
it depends somewhat on the animal, the environment, and the behavior. By and large, when you get the behavior to the level of 80 percent of the time it, the behavior, is what you want (the final behavior), you should begin the cue training. This is one of the infamous "rules of thumb," where there is great latitude in when and how to apply it.

Here are some of the factors to consider: If the behavior is simple and easy for the animal, especially if it is something the animal naturally does on its own, such as a dog's SIT, I would cue it earlier rather than later. If the behavior is a precision behavior, that might be somewhat difficult to do, I would do it a bit later, when the final behavior is a bit stronger.
Reliability of Behavior, Desensitization
Most trainers, in my experience, get a behavior right, or nearly right, a few times, and then, figuring perhaps that the behavior is now learned, move on. WRONG! In much the same way, there some trainers seem to have the notion that, when an unwanted behavior appears extinguished for several trial, then that behavior is no longer in the animals repertoire. WRONG, too!
Distractions
 

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Discussion Starter · #7 ·
And once again, MikeyT to the rescue! I love reading through all the links you post. Thank you!

Why a verbal cue? Well, I hadn't really thought about it, but that's just what we usually do in the classes I take Molly to. Not sure if it's required for her to be able to do the action with a verbal command in order to "graduate" or not.:rolleyes:

However, I do have to teach her something that we do not work on in class for us to demonstrate on the last class day. Still haven't figured that one out yet.
 

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it's required for her to be able to do the action with a verbal command in order to "graduate" or not
FWIW AKC obedience trials require either at novice require either one just not both together and what often happens in training a verbal cue when the dog already has a physical one is it becaomes dependant on both occuring. It is certainly something that cn be worked through but often time we humans tend to do things in dog training that we don't think about and send time on thing that don;t really matter.

A verbal recall cetainly a verbal down hmm not so much. Hech in the highest level of obedience the dog need a hand sign and not a verbal cue. for down Not haveing a verbal cue can have its draw back. Such a when anther person is taking care of or attempting to control the dog. A human can be confuesd when your trained dog does not do what they ask because hand signal are foreign to them

As in a previous discusion and you may want to have one with your husband as well because the whole hand signal thing might not work for him. again it is not important so much what you need for the class always keep in mind it you that has to live with the dog not the class or the instructor You can alway train a verbal cue later if you feel it is necessary as well.

in training a verbal cue you have two basic option. Start all over again training the down like you did with the physical cue. You must make a contious effort to refrain from cue the behavior and start adding the verbal cue when you can reliable preddiect the dog is going to lie down, Or you can simply train the verbal cue in conjuction with the physical one. First daying down the following with the physical cue. occasion test the dog by waiting a bit before the bysicl cue to se if the dog will down with out it if is does then jackpot and continue to attept to fade the physical cue. It is not that easy. Often time the dog will start to go down on the verbal but stop when not followed by the physical What you can do their is start rewarding the first movement toward a dow with the clicker, and work toward shaping the down. It alway good to think about what you want the cue to be before you begin training to eliminte as many double/multiple cue situation as possible because the will alway haunt you in training. Sort of like repeating verbal cue. The reall cue is no longer come but comecomecome etc.

However, I do have to teach her something that we do not work on in class for us to demonstrate on the last class day
This is were a lot do some sort of trick training. spin, shake hands etc Im not big on trick training t has it purpose don't get me wrong for me personnal have have a difficult time being motivated to train something that in not utiltarian,

off - get of a high object to the ground or floor You will find links to training this in a lot of the resource guarding thread IMHO it is as importat a training exrecise as swaping objects for resource guarders. you will find in basset it is probable more that gard a comfortable spot as anything else. A non confrontation method to get them to move is the way to go/

got to mat or spot. very usefull when preparing dinner theirs or yours

go to the crate from a distance again useful onto it self but more so as distance skill training and foundation for other "crate games" that are great at teaching self control.

targeting this may be taught in class but if not it can be a great way to get behaviors and also position the dog anywhere you want.


hand targeting with mariah warming up exercise before and agility run

it is very easy to teach. Hold out had in fron of dogs nose an inch or two at most dog will reach out to smell when it touches your hand with nose click treat resist urge to move your hand toward dog. This goes quick. Feed with hand that is not target If dog start being attrated to the had with food even better as now you are disctraction trainign as well. Switch hand a repeat starting from the beging. as you prgress move hand farther from the dog change the postion in relationship to dog little higher little lower left right, When the behavior is trong you can use the target to move the dog it follows your hand, You hand becomes a lure and does need to have food in it how cool is that!. Think how hand that is in training other behaviors.


You can morph the hand target to antoher opject like a plastic lid. Star off with putting the lid in you hand dog touches lid click etc slowly work closer to the ground floor until the back hand is on the ground then place lid by it self on the ground. Once that behavior is strong delay clicking for a single touch and require two multiple touches work on decreasing latency see links above. The lid becaome a target you can use to train distance work having the dog go out. Teaching the dog to go to a mat but the target on the mat send dog to target etc. it a potent tool to have.

Target Training Get your dog in the position YOU want!

Dog Obedience Training through Targeting
This seemingly frivolous behavior has numerous practical applications
Even today, despite its usefulness, targeting is not a widely known behavior outside positive professional training and competition circles. When I introduce the concept in my basic good manners classes I get a sea of blank stares in response, as if each human client is thinking, “Why on earth would I want to teach my dog to do that?”
Targeting means teaching your dog to touch a designated body part to a designated location. Nose targeting is most commonly taught, but it can also be trained with a front or hind paw, a hip or shoulder, even an ear or tail! The designated target can also be anything imaginable, including the palm of your hand or your closed fist, a finger, target stick, spot on the wall or door, or just about any object you choose to ask your dog to target to.

...It’s ridiculously easy to teach. We start in our classes by having the dog target to his owner’s hand, since that doesn’t require yet another piece of equipment to juggle along with clicker, treats, and leash.
Teach Hand Targeting to Dogs
included video

shaping a noes touch to a plate
 
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