[pinehawk]

well that time of the year is gearing up again.In Lynnville,IN.on March 26,27,28th.The AHBA WORLD HUNT this is the Super Bowl for the AHBA crowd!!!! there should be well over 100 Bassets competing for the title of World Champion in their respected classes.and if you can't make it to INDY,in Pennsylvania on the 27th and 28th of March is the FIRST AKC Trial of the Spring.Being put on by the SUSQUEHANNA BASSET HOUND CLUB.it is being held at the Beauitful Lebanon County Beagle Club in MT.Zion,PA.i here that the vice-president and field trial committee chairman of Susquehanna is one of the most knowledgeable people in the field basset scene today,go and ask for him, he will be more than HAPPY to show you how a formal field trial runs.this club is also supporting a chance for spay and nuter dogs to run in a NON-REGULAR Class.still waiting for approval on that.

[ February 17, 2004, 12:07 PM: Message edited by: pinehawk ]

 

[Guest]

Billy give me any info you get on the spay class. I'll give 100% support for field trials if they offer this class. You know how I feel about this. Belinda.

 

[Guest]

Billy, is there a website where I can get some general information, e.g., location, driving directions, schedule, etc.? Or an email contact?

Depending on our schedules, we might be able to swing by and see it. We're not competitors; we just think it would be enjoyable to watch.

You can PM me if you wish, or post outright.

Thanks!

 

[pinehawk]

the AHBA Web Address is www.bassetnet.com and the AKC Trial Schedule can be found at the AKC Website at www.akc.org look under events or go to the BHCA website www.basset-bhca.org Belinda,will do!! we voted on this in the Fall at our meeting.it was voted on and approved by our FTAC Committee(if i remember correctily),now it's trying to see what class to run them in? Open Class i'm pushing for because they have to earn their points to run in the Champ class i feel.the draw back is the AKC right now does not allow this as you know,i will found out more this weekend.i would think that if the parent group(BHCA) would step up and help out with a petition to the AKC to allow this i would think it could happen!!!i really don't know who would contact the AKC i'm just guessing that's how it would be done. Billy

 

[Betsy Iole]

FTAC voted to recommend allowing spayed and neutered bassets to compete in field trials??? My understanding is that FTAC has been the source of resistance to this idea, not BHCA or AKC. As I understand things, changes to the basset field trial regs aren't made unless and until FTAC signs off on them and passes them on to AKC for consideration? And that even if BHCA wanted to recommend changes to the regs, these changes wouldn't be considered by AKC in the absence of FTAC's approval, because the basset field trials are governed by FTAC's recommendations?

[ February 18, 2004, 05:35 PM: Message edited by: Betsy Iole ]

 

[pinehawk]

i'll find out from Kay what's going on than!! at our fall meeting our club FTAC Rep. said it passed because she was against it,and was out voted.i'm e-mailing her right now!!! i'll be back!!!!!!

 

[Guest]

I'm ignorant....what's FTAC? At Nationals it was a big deal about changing Field Trials to allow neutered Bassets to compete in field trials (a separate class is FINE with me). What can I do? I was under the assumption it was the AKC that was the final governing body, not the BHCA. HELP!! Belinda.

 

[Betsy Iole]

FTAC=Field Trial Advisory Committee. If it works like other advisory committees, FTAC makes its recommendations to AKC, and AKC considers them and has final say. In order for AKC to consider any recommendations, they must originate with FTAC. Don't know whether BHCA rubber stamps FTAC's recommendations, but BHCA *can't* do an end run around FTAC. (And if I'm FOS, I hope someone will set the record straight.)

 

[Mikey T]

As much as I would like to tell Betsy she is FOS on this point she is correct. For many other breeds field trials allow spay and nuetered to compete and not always as a separate class. THe AKC really does not care but will go along with the FTAC. The hunting test was developed as an end around the FTAC by creating a field trial like event that is not a field trial so it is open to all bassets.


The Dachsund field trial has no 2-b in Standard Procedures exclusion of spayed and neutered dogs as is the case for both beagle and bassets. However Language in eligibility appears to be standard AKC lanquage for all field trials and Identical for Bassets, beagles and dachsunds. It does not allow for ILP's. Therefore even if spay and nuetered dogs were allowed, rescue dogs with ILP's would still not be allowed to compete unless addition changes were made.

 

[Dean]

FTAC is a part of BHCA and does not deal directly with AKC !! BHCA goes along with FTAC suggestions as long as it is convenient. If FTAC says the trial grounds at a potential site for the nationals are not adequate, BHCA says LIVE WITH IT!!! FTAC is an advisory group with no authority. BHCA has final say. AKC does not care about what dogs BHCA allows to enter a field trial. AKC does advertise and promote responsible pet owners to have dogs neutered, but will not suggest that BHCA allow neutered hounds to enter trials.

 

[Betsy Iole]

Thanks for the explanation, Dean. That all makes sense. So, the process is FTAC makes a recommendation, and BHCA forwards it to AKC for it to become effective. The original question involved changes to the regs; recommendations for regs changes must still originate with FTAC, no?

 

[pinehawk]

Mike,a dog with an AKC limited registation is eligible for entry in LICENSED or MEMBER CLUB field trials.An unregistered hound that is part of an AKC registered litter or an unregistered hound with an acceptable foreign registration that was whelped outside of the U.S.A. and that is owned by a resident of the U.S.or of a country with a foreign registry organization whose pedigree is acceptable for AKC registration may,WITHOUT special AKC approval,be entered in licensed or member field trials that are held not later than 30 days after the date of the first licensed or member field trial in which the hound was entered,but only provided that the AKC litter registration number or the individual foreign registration number and the name of the country of birth are shown on the entry form,and provided further than the same name,which in the case of an imported hound must be the name on the foreign registration,is used for the hound each time. whew!!!!

 

[Guest]

Molly is an ILP registered Basset with a conformation Champion BHCA member bred sire and I couldn't enter her in a field trial "special" class unless I had her litter registration #? I registered her with an ILP # on purpose to advertise that not all rescues are from pet shops. I'm sorry, but that whole field trial thing is ridiculous. What are they so worried about? That our altered hounds are going to ruin the breed, or that my rescue, spayed, conformation, obedience titled, agility legged, AHBA Rabbit Champion and BHCA Senior Hunting Hound might beat their dogs??!! Good grief! Gotta go to work, bye! Belinda.

 

[pinehawk]

Belinda,from what i read into the rule is she could do the trials with an ILP.it's the spay thing.the whole thing is trying to breed a hunting animal,and KEEP it going.now from what i can recall about our fall meeting was that one person felt that by allowing spayed dogs was UNFAIR because their hounds would come in to season and not be able to compete!! I can understand what they are saying but if you CHOOSE to Breed that's the price you pay,if you don't want to breed and you spay your hound run all the trials you want.

 

[Jersey Girls plus]

Thanks for the info! One question though, what's the difference between AHBA hunts and the formal field trial? Dean, you did explain this to me once, but it's lost in my brain.

 

[pinehawk]

AHBA is more of a hunt test style and go for one hour a cast.AKC Trials your dog has to perform and run a cleaner rabbit( fewer mistakes).i'm still up in the air on which ones i like more, the mass havoc when 6 hounds start pounding a rabbit,or the cleaner more stylish way they run in brace.that's why i do both!!!!!!

 

[Dean]

First, Billy -- a hound with an ilp number may not run in a field trial. Hounds with limited registration can.
Second -- AKC trials are run by keeping the hounds on lead until the gallery has beaten the brush to find a rabbit. then both hounds are released on the line and scored on style not accomplishment. In the AHBA the hounds are released in the field - they have to hunt, find and run a rabbit. Scoring is based on accomplishing something. If we can't find any rabbits, the scoring is based on hunting ability. In the AKC trials, if there are no rabbits, the hunt continues tomorrow.

 

[pinehawk]

you are correct about the ILP,Dean as a matter of fact,about the only thing these dogs can't compete in is a field trial??? WHY??? i say let's change that too!!! now as for keeping hounds on the lead,at the JUDGES request they can be cast to search for game!!! but we don't have a hour to wait for them to do it.release them on the line has some good points to,we know it's a RABBIT and which way it's going.and as for the stlye over accomplishment that's always been the biggest load of crap compliant i've heard even in SPO trials!!! you know there are some AKC dogs out there that are whipping up on some dogs in the AHBA Hunts,because you own a few of those F.C.'s yourself.

[ February 19, 2004, 05:58 PM: Message edited by: pinehawk ]

 

[Guest]

All dogs with ILP #'s have to be spayed or neutered. If they don't have that neutered/spayed certificate from the vet they can't get their ILP registration. And they have to be "certifiable" Basset from the AKC via a picture and explanation as to why the owner thinks their dog is pure bred, albeit without "papers". So bitches in season can't compete, altered Bassets can't compete, but intact males can compete all the time??!! HELLO!! Take care, Belinda.

 

[Dean]

Billy, if any judge suggested that the hounds be cast to hunt at a field trial, he would most likely be fired immediately and certainly would never judge naother field trial !!! The rules do allow casting, but trialers don't. The rules also allow three hounds to run, but when it was done at one trial, about 1/3 of the entries were scratched. Keep one thing in mind, the AKC tolerates bending any rule as long as nobody really complains. example-- how did the walkie-talkie beagle come to exist under rules that say the hounds should pursue with intent to overtake the game.???