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Discussion Starter #1
I've decided to do a switch with the kids food. I was talking to their breeder today and she was telling me how much she likes this food. Her hounds love it and she loves the ingredient list. I called Petsmart and they carry it. It comes in a 6 lb, 15 lb & 30 lb size. The 30 lb. is $40. I'm paying "almost" that much for the Eukanuba. I'm getting a small bag and will start the switch. Here's their website if anyone wants to read up on the food. Also, anyone have any input???

www.bluebuff.com
 

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When your dog food sounds like it's coming from a trendy restaurant, it must be good :D
 

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i would rather feed purina hi-pro than this food.i feel the protein and fat levels are to low.i don't like the fish based formula's myself at all. i'm not a fan of Hi-Pro either.but i do feed Purina Pro Plan.the thing with the fish is this,there is a Whitefish,but i think they are using by-catch from the fishing industry. if they use farm raised fish they are full of chemicals to make them grow bigger faster so they can get to market sooner,if they are wild ocean caught fish what is the mercury levels like,they now warn pregnant women to not eat canned tuna fish more than once a week i think ,because of mercury. the bottm line is feed what your dog does good on and what you can afford. i use the Performance blends and have good results but my dogs are active hunting dogs,a 26%protein 18% fat chicken based feed i think is the best type of food for most dogs.if you do feed this fish based stuff let us know how your dogs are doing on it after 3-4 months,i would be interested in learning your findings. thanks Billy
 

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Murray has been on Wellness Fish and Sweet Potato for 3 1/2 years because he is allergic to beef, chicken, lamb- you name it. He's done well on it- I mix canned pumpkin with it, brown rice, yogurt, salmon or tuna when we have it. It's $28 for a 15 pound bag here.
 

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Let us know how it goes. I'm intrigued by that food as well. Let me know if it changes their breath at all. I'd tried a fish based food before and it was smelly breath city!


Not that its usually great smelling to begin with, you know?
 

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. I was talking to their breeder today and she was telling me how much she likes this food. Her hounds love it and she loves the ingredient list.
www.bluebuff.com
[/b]

A dog food that contains garlic and is touted as containing garlic one has to wonder. While it is unlikely there is enough garlic to cause a significant problem Onions more so than garlic are linked to some serious health problem in dogs and are best avoided

Feeding Onions/Garlic -
There have been reports of anemia, dermatitis and asthmatic attacks after the long term feeding of garlic and garlic extracts to dogs.


...3. Hematologic changes associated with the appearance of eccentrocytes after intragastric administration of garlic extract to dogs.

Lee KW, Yamato O, Tajima M, Kuraoka M, Omae S, Maede Y.

Am J Vet Res 2000 Nov 61(11):1446-50

Department of Veterinary Clinical Sciences, Graduate School of Veterinary Medicine, Hokkaido University, Sapporo, Japan.

...CONCLUSIONS AND CLINICAL RELEVANCE: The constituents of garlic have the potential to oxidize erythrocyte membranes and hemoglobin, inducing hemolysis associated with the appearance of eccentrocytes in dogs. Thus, foods containing garlic should not be fed to dogs. Eccentrocytosis appears to be a major diagnostic feature of garlic-induced hemolysis in dogs.
[/b]
 

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I copied this information from the Wellness site:

"Wellness Fish & Sweet Potato Dog Food:
One of the most allergen-free foods available for your pet. A unique formula of White Fish and Sweet Potatoes with an optimal balance of Omega 6 and Omega 3 for a healthy skin and coat.
Ingredients:
White Fish, Ground Barley, Rye Flour, Menhaden Fish Meal, Whole Sweet Potatoes, Canola Oil (preserved with Rosemary, Vitamin C & E), Flax Seed, Beta-Carotene, Potassium Chloride, Zinc Proteinate (a chelated source of Zinc), Ferrous Sulfate, Zinc Sulfate, Vitamin E Supplement, Copper Proteinate (a chelated source of Copper), and more."


Unlike the Blue Buffalo Fish and Sweet Potato, it doesn't contain garlic. For Murray, who is allergic to most other protein sources, it's been great. As I said, I also make a kind of stew to add to this with fish,brown rice,pumpkin, yogurt, etc.

And to answer the fish breath question: no, it doesn't make Murray smell fishy.
 

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As I said, I also make a kind of stew to add to this with fish,brown rice,pumpkin, yogurt, etc.[/b]
When I read your earlier post, I thought it sounded so good I'd eat it! :D
 

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Discussion Starter #9
Thanks for all your input. I have some thinking to do!!! I'll keep you posted!

Wishing all of you a HAPPY NEW YEAR!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
 

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Discussion Starter #10
This is the email I got to my questions to the Blue Buffalo Dog Food Co.

Thank you for taking the time out to write us. And thank you for your
interest in BLUE. In response to your email, in
> numerous clinical studies, garlic has been clinically proven to have
> beneficial health properties for animals such as a potent antioxidant,
> anti-cancer, antibacterial and viral, antiseptic and as an
> immunostimulant.
>
> In addition it has been proven to lower cholesterol levels, lower
> blood pressure, help control diarrhea and is a sources of beneficial
> vitamins, minerals and important phytonutrients.
>
> While numerous chat rooms and written papers and articles are
> discussing the potential toxicity effects with onions (and now with
> garlic) these are really anecdotal discussions and there is no
> definitive proof that a specific dose of garlic that is toxic for dogs.
>
> The real truth is that many food derived nutrients that are fed at
> high levels can be toxic. The best example is vitamin A, an essential
> and beneficial vitamin will cause toxicity if fed at high levels.
>
> Another example is the feeding of baby food to cats that contains
> onion powder, which has resulted in anemia. It is believed that
> processed powdered onions contains more concentrated levels of toxic
> ingredients such as sulfoxides which can lead to fragility of the red
blood cells.
>
> The important point to remember is anemia that is secondary to feeding
> onions (and garlic) is totally dose dependent. The more onions or
> garlic that is fed the more possibility of problems. One study that
> incriminated onions as the cause of anemia said that a 50-pound dog
> would have to eating 6-8 ounces of onions/day.
>
> Blue Buffalos formulas are made with fresh garlic because fresh garlic
> has more of the naturally occurring phyto-nutrients, antioxidants and
> beneficial nutrients than other more processed forms. More
> importantly, the levels of garlic selected for Blue Buffalo's
> formulations is the level that has been researched and tested in
> thousands of animals over the past 20 years and found to be beneficial
> for the health and well being of animals.

I hope this helps clear up your concerns. Please feel free to contact me
with any further questions.
 

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I'm now feeding Baxter all natural Nutro lamb and rice puppy formula. He really likes it and his stomach seems a lot better. I have a friend who mentioned that he is using Blue for his Wheaten Terrier puppy and is happy with it.
 

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Gah. Reading that email response from them, I'd stay away from them, Maggie's Mom. The problems with onions and garlic aren't anecdotal. It is true that - from what I understand - there's some lack of clarity about what's going on, but the links between serious health problems and onion/garlic have been established.

Sounds like they're jumping on a trendy bandwagon, hate to say, and that email is a real red flag for me.

Also, I'm totally with pinehawk when it comes to this. I feed my pups a high fat food - I've stayed with Black Gold - and they do fabulously on it. Lady, who is ancient and arthritic and has horrid problems with dysplasia, thrives on it, too. Besides, the fish thing is *very* problematic.
 

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Maggie's Mom,

The part in the company's response that has me curious has to do with dosage. They mention the amount of onion and garlic that would be required to be toxic to the dogs (large amounts according to them). But how much garlic and onion does a dog have to ingest to benefit from the garlic and onion? Is there "enough" garlic and onion in the food for the dogs to reap the benefits and not enough for them to be harmed by it?

I would ask further questions. Colleen
 

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We make our own food and it is the best thing we could have ever done! No more anal gland problems at all. I make one batch a week and he thinks it is Christmas every day, twice a day ;)

Baxters Mama
 

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I just read over at VetInfo that the amount is about an onion's worth. He mentions that dogs can usually tolerate smaller amounts, but (and I quote) there might be "measurable changes on lab test results."

That would be enough for me to stay away from it.

We're pretty similar to dogs, but we're also different. Eg, chocolate is good for us! but apparently can't be digested by dogs? or something and accumulates to a toxoc level.

In addition, the vitamin a toxicity reference they make is to *extremely* high amounts of vitamin a, like you would find in some vitamin preparations and very rarely, in foods --- there's some kind of animal liver in Alaska, I think, that is extremely high in vitamin a levels and has caused toxicity in humans.

Otherwise, that's a very poor comparison.

I'm also not convinced dogs would receive the same benefits from onions and garlic that we do. It's my understanding cholesterol, for example, just isn't an issue for dogs, even though they have it. So the mechanisms for heart disease in dogs are apparently different than they are for humans.

And I'm saying this as an avid onion and garlic fan. I eat onions and garlic daily, and fully believe in their benefits for *me* - but that doesn't translate into a necessary benefit for my pups.

I think it's a lot of money to pay for something made by people who have jumped on a bandwagon and may not really know what they're doing or are willing to justify doing less than the best.

Btw, I also used to make food, just like jonloanranger. It worked out fabulously! But I'm too busy doing other things right now to do that, plus am no longer dealing with anal gland problems. I do do it on occasion, though - mostly chicken stocks and chicken and rice because Lady is absolutely ancient and sometimes loses her appetite, except for those things.
 

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We make our own food and it is the best thing we could have ever done! No more anal gland problems at all. I make one batch a week and he thinks it is Christmas every day, twice a day ;)

Baxters Mama[/b]
what do you put in your food, I would be interested in the recipe if you don't mind.
 

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The claim is made that they have revolutionized pet food processing. They do not have their own manufacturing facility but use a private label company that produces products for many different brands.[/b]
In addition to the above read what Wysong has to say about Blue Buffalo.
 

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Blue is one of the most natural foods that you can feed. It does not have any corn or other fillers, which are proven to cause cancer in dogs. I refuse to feed my baby anything with corn or other fillers in it. I am putting my baby on blue, it is a holistic food, which means it is all natural. It's not people food, just natural. It's the next best thing to making your own natural dog foods at home. I guess that every dog food has it's pros and cons, but I beleive in everything natural. I take natural herbs and eat natural foods myself. My mom was diagnosed with cancer 16 years ago, was treated, and has been taking herbs ever since, and she has been cancer free for 16 years now! So I can't help beleiving in natural foods.
 

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Discussion Starter #19
I was hoping to feed this with success. I did the transition very slowly. The kids loved the food but both had VERY loose stools. I did the change so gradually and they just were not adjusting. The manager at PetSmart where I shop told me that it is very rich and maybe that's why their systems didn't adjust :rolleyes: Who knows! So they are back on Eukanuba Lamb & Rice which is fine by me. I liked the ingredient list and it came recommended to me so I thought I'd give it a try.
 

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Blue is one of the most natural foods that you can feed. It does not have any corn or other fillers, which are proven to cause cancer in dogs. I refuse to feed my baby anything with corn or other fillers in it. I am putting my baby on blue, it is a holistic food, which means it is all natural. It's not people food, just natural. It's the next best thing to making your own natural dog foods at home. I guess that every dog food has it's pros and cons, but I beleive in everything natural. I take natural herbs and eat natural foods myself. My mom was diagnosed with cancer 16 years ago, was treated, and has been taking herbs ever since, and she has been cancer free for 16 years now! So I can't help beleiving in natural foods.[/b]

Corn causes cancer in dogs please site the studies before making such outragous claims. as for Natural and or holistic foods can you please define what they are Natural is a very loose term with a wide ranging exception under Aafco standards see
"AAFCO Definition: Natural "": A feed or ingredient derived solely from plant, animal or mined sources, either in its unprocessed state or having been subject to physical processing, heat processing, rendering, purification, extraction, hydrolysis, enzymolysis or fermentation, but not having been produced by or subject to a chemically synthetic process and not containing any additives or processing aids that are chemically synthetic except in amounts as might occur unavoidably in good manufacturing practices.
The AAFCO further limits the use of "natural" on pet food labels to allow the use of the term "natural" in reference to the product as a whole when all of the ingredients and components of ingredients meet the definition. AAFCO recommends exceptions be made with the addition of chemically synthesized vitamins, minerals, or other trace nutrients to food products, with a suitable disclaimer that those additives are not "natural.""

Who says a product is 'natural'?
"As it pertains to pet food, the use of the term natural has become the latest and greatest marketing tool, but it is not yet fully backed by consistent federal guidelines. AAFCO (Association of American Feed Control Officials) is a governing body that publishes definitions for terms such as ‘natural’ in pet food, pet treats, and other pet products. However, each individual state is not required to follow the AAFCO definition and is in charge of writing and enforcing their own definitions and laws. So, for example, what’s considered ‘natural’ in Kansas may be different than what Vermont considers ‘natural’. In addition, the AAFCO recommended definition of the term “natural” loose enough to do little to defend consumers against synthetic ingredients. The official AAFCO definition of the term “natural” reads as follows: “A feed or ingredient derived solely from plant, animal or mined sources, either in its unprocessed state or having been subject to physical processing, heat processing, rendering, purification, extraction, hydrolysis, enzymolysis or fermentation, but not having been produced by or subjected to a chemically synthetic process and not containing any additives or processing aids that are chemically synthetic except in amounts as might occur unavoidably in good manufacturing practices.” Whew! That’s a mouthful. There are loopholes the size of Texas in this definition. For example, the “good manufacturing practices” are not defined. Also, there are provisions in the AAFCO definition that allow for use of the term “natural” as long as the packaging also includes a disclaimer – such as with cases where synthetic vitamins are added to a given product. " '

and of course Holistic is not defined at all.
 
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