"Pedigree Dogs Exposed"

Kirska · 02-10-2011, 11:27 AM

Did anyone else see the documentary Pedigree Dogs Exposed that was originally from the UK that has started airing in the US? I saw it on PBS last night.

I was wondering what your thoughts were on it. Basset hounds were featured in the documentary.

Pedigree Dogs Exposed - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Quote:

When it was put to the Chairman of the Basset Hound Club that they were breeding deformed congenital dwarfs, he rejected that accusation, claiming that current Basset Hounds look very much like those of the 1800s. When shown a photo of a Basset Hound from sixty years ago, he was less than impressed.

SophieB · 02-10-2011, 11:48 AM

I don't think Bassets came over half as badly as King Charles Spaniels, Pugs and Boxers!

Kirska · 02-10-2011, 12:22 PM

I was appalled by the lady that was using her champion stud to sire over 2 dozen litters even though he'd already been diagnosed with that terribly painful genetic disease. She acted so upset when they asked her about it. If you've got nothing to hide, you've got nothing to be shameful about. She obviously knew it wasn't right.

I have a cousin that has one of the Cavalier spaniels. Her dog was the runt and has a skull deformity. Her friend bred her and I guess didn't know what she wanted to do with her after selling the rest of the litter so my cousin offered to take her. She's a very sweet dog but it wouldn't surprise me if she ended up having that disease.

Soundtrack · 02-10-2011, 09:31 PM

It is NOT a documentary. It was put together by a woman who HATES purebreds, they found the worst possible examples and tried to make them look like the norm, they misled the people they interviewed and quoted them out of context, used half-truths, old wives tales and outright lies.

Excellent article on the subject:
http://rufflyspeaking.wordpress.com/2008/10/15/568/

bubbad · 02-10-2011, 09:45 PM

No wonder the Springbatt people were on their high horse about "Pedigreed Dogs". I prefer purebreds ,myself

mhvonalmen8908 · 02-10-2011, 10:43 PM

I just read both the articles you linked Soundtrack. It just blows my mind about how the "documentary" apparently misrepresented the breeds and took quotes out of context. I'm going to see if I can find the actual "documentary" online and watch it. And I don't think Bassets are all that different from the olden days. But the sloping hindquarters of the German Shepards is a bit disconcerting to look at. It looks like they're scared all the time. To me anyway.

Kirska · 02-11-2011, 09:19 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bubbad

No wonder the Springbatt people were on their high horse about "Pedigreed Dogs". I prefer purebreds ,myself

I don't think it's fair to make a sweeping statement that purebreds are better, just as I don't think it's fair to make a sweeping statement that mutts are better. A poorly bred "purebred", in my opinion, will probably be worse than a mutt.

Quote:

It is NOT a documentary. It was put together by a woman who HATES purebreds, they found the worst possible examples and tried to make them look like the norm, they misled the people they interviewed and quoted them out of context, used half-truths, old wives tales and outright lies.

Excellent article on the subject:
The implications of the KC decision on Pekingese; Pedigree Dogs Exposed, part 2 Ruffly Speaking: Railing against idiocy since 2004

I also don't think it's fair to claim that the film is not a documentary. It's not uncommon for documentaries to be incredibly biased. Just look at Michael Moore.

I will say that I think the film challenges the idea many have that registration papers somehow inherently makes a dog healthier, something that I, personally, strongly disagree with. My mutt is turning 11 this year and is by and large much healthier than any 11 year old purebred dog I've had.

Soundtrack · 02-11-2011, 12:36 PM

Nobody is claiming that registration papers make a dog healthier, or better in any way at all. Most purebreds are bred by crappy breeders who are either out to make a buck and/or want a whole bunch of cute little "Princesses" because they wuv her so much they want another just like her.

But that goes for mutts too. I've known more than my share of people who want to breed their precious darling, even though she snaps at kids, hides under furniture when people come over, and has horrible skin allergies.

The difference is that a carefully bred dog whose ancestors have been selected for generations for temperament, health, structure and quality is going to be a better bet than one that is not.

And before you say that show breeders don't care about those things, remember that the vast majority of us live with our dogs and they are our pets. So yeah, I care. I don't want a psycho nutbar dog that I can't take out in public or is difficult to live with. I don't want a dog that costs me a fortune in vet bills, or dies young. I don't want a dog that can't live a normal life and do the activities we like to do.

BTW,
I have three sisters who will be turning 13 in June. One has cancer, the other two are quite healthy and active for dogs of that age. In fact, Gabby competed in Rally-O this past fall, and will be out again in the spring to get her final leg. Rosie at 9 1/2 is still bouncing off the walls, she ran in the agility trial last October at Nationals. Overall I've had very few health problems with my bassets over the past 30 years - but then mine are from well-bred SHOW lines.

And I don't consider what Michael Moore does to be documentaries either. That's like calling an op-ed piece "news".

Kirska · 02-11-2011, 01:32 PM

A lot of people do feel more comfortable buying a dog with papers instead of an identical dog without papers. Probably not the type of folks that you deal with as a reputable breeder, but I'm referring to the general public. If you look in a newspaper at backyard breeder ads, you'll see as many as possible list "AKC registered" right in the ad because they know it's a selling point despite the fact that no one buying one of their puppies actually needs those papers for anything.

I'm not disagreeing that your dogs are better than mutts. You obviously care. But you said right in your post that most breeders don't. You know this and I know this but the general public doesn't. We see this almost every time someone comes to this forum looking for a puppy.

The majority of breeders are bad, therefore the majority of purebred dogs are a crap-shoot. No not yours, and no not all, but a whole lot of them.

The welfare of dogs would improve leaps and bounds if society as a whole accepted that you're not getting a guaranteed better dog than a mutt when you buy from an average breeder.

Soundtrack · 02-11-2011, 03:43 PM

Quote:

The majority of breeders are bad, therefore the majority of purebred dogs are a crap-shoot

Um, but even fewer mutt breeders are any good. In fact, almost none. Therefore even more of them are a crap-shoot.

Not too long ago I read one of those "magazines" that they have in pet stores for individual breeds, but this one was devoted to "designer dogs". Even though the publication extolled the virtues of mixed breeds, they admitted that finding a quality breeder of such animals was on a par with winning the lottery.

The problem is there is way more demand for puppies than there are good breeders to fill it. And people are impatient. They want their puppy now, they don't want to go on a waiting list. They don't want to go to the trouble of researching breeders, or even which breed they should have, or even whether they should have a dog at all. And they sure as heck don't want to spend a lot - unless it's at a pet store and they can whip out their AMEX, or they're paying for a "special" designer dog or "rare" (read disqualifying fault, mismark, wrong color, under- or oversized, wrong coat) purebred - then they'll spend way more than what you'd pay for a quality pet from a good breeder. So there's plenty of people willing to fill the demand with "purebreds" that barely resemble the breed they're supposed to be, teacups, doodles, chiweenees, puggles or whatever will sell.

But all of that has nothing to do with show dogs, which is what the show is denigrating. The fact is that your chances of ending up with a healthy, sound animal are higher if you go to one of the hated "show breeders". Not guaranteed - first of all we're dealing with living creatures and anything can happen, secondly we're dealing with people and not all of them are wonderful (even the ones that show dogs

). But the odds are more in your favor.

02-10-2011, 12:22 PM	#3 (permalink)
Kirska Senior Member Join Date: Jun 2010 Location: Dallas, TX Posts: 932	I was appalled by the lady that was using her champion stud to sire over 2 dozen litters even though he'd already been diagnosed with that terribly painful genetic disease. She acted so upset when they asked her about it. If you've got nothing to hide, you've got nothing to be shameful about. She obviously knew it wasn't right. I have a cousin that has one of the Cavalier spaniels. Her dog was the runt and has a skull deformity. Her friend bred her and I guess didn't know what she wanted to do with her after selling the rest of the litter so my cousin offered to take her. She's a very sweet dog but it wouldn't surprise me if she ended up having that disease. __________________ Mom to Anabelle and Lila, rescued ladies and Harley, Corgi/Beagle/Basset/?? mutt "Saving just one dog won't change the world, but it surely will change the world for that one dog." - Richard C. Call

02-10-2011, 09:31 PM	#4 (permalink)
Soundtrack Senior Member Join Date: Jul 2001 Location: Ottawa, Ontario, Canada Posts: 2,580	It is NOT a documentary. It was put together by a woman who HATES purebreds, they found the worst possible examples and tried to make them look like the norm, they misled the people they interviewed and quoted them out of context, used half-truths, old wives tales and outright lies. Excellent article on the subject: http://rufflyspeaking.wordpress.com/2008/10/15/568/ __________________ Rosie-Ch Soundtrack Cracklin' Rose CGN AGN RA Am RN TT Melody-Ch Soundtrack Unchained Melody TT Sailor-Ch Soundtrack Expedition Sailor RN TT Chili-Ch Soundtrack Spice Up Your Life Curry-Ch Soundtrack Canadian Brass Pepper-Ch Pennieslogon Living La Vida Loca CGN Vina-Ch Soundtrack Grand Illusion Leila-Ch Soundtrack Almost Paradise Deela-Ch Soundtrack Wink Of An Eye Hermione - Soundtrack Spellbound Eowyn - Soundtrack Rain Dance Last edited by Soundtrack; 02-10-2011 at 09:46 PM.

02-11-2011, 12:36 PM	#8 (permalink)
Soundtrack Senior Member Join Date: Jul 2001 Location: Ottawa, Ontario, Canada Posts: 2,580	Nobody is claiming that registration papers make a dog healthier, or better in any way at all. Most purebreds are bred by crappy breeders who are either out to make a buck and/or want a whole bunch of cute little "Princesses" because they wuv her so much they want another just like her. But that goes for mutts too. I've known more than my share of people who want to breed their precious darling, even though she snaps at kids, hides under furniture when people come over, and has horrible skin allergies. The difference is that a carefully bred dog whose ancestors have been selected for generations for temperament, health, structure and quality is going to be a better bet than one that is not. And before you say that show breeders don't care about those things, remember that the vast majority of us live with our dogs and they are our pets. So yeah, I care. I don't want a psycho nutbar dog that I can't take out in public or is difficult to live with. I don't want a dog that costs me a fortune in vet bills, or dies young. I don't want a dog that can't live a normal life and do the activities we like to do. BTW, I have three sisters who will be turning 13 in June. One has cancer, the other two are quite healthy and active for dogs of that age. In fact, Gabby competed in Rally-O this past fall, and will be out again in the spring to get her final leg. Rosie at 9 1/2 is still bouncing off the walls, she ran in the agility trial last October at Nationals. Overall I've had very few health problems with my bassets over the past 30 years - but then mine are from well-bred SHOW lines. And I don't consider what Michael Moore does to be documentaries either. That's like calling an op-ed piece "news". __________________ Rosie-Ch Soundtrack Cracklin' Rose CGN AGN RA Am RN TT Melody-Ch Soundtrack Unchained Melody TT Sailor-Ch Soundtrack Expedition Sailor RN TT Chili-Ch Soundtrack Spice Up Your Life Curry-Ch Soundtrack Canadian Brass Pepper-Ch Pennieslogon Living La Vida Loca CGN Vina-Ch Soundtrack Grand Illusion Leila-Ch Soundtrack Almost Paradise Deela-Ch Soundtrack Wink Of An Eye Hermione - Soundtrack Spellbound Eowyn - Soundtrack Rain Dance

02-11-2011, 01:32 PM	#9 (permalink)
Kirska Senior Member Join Date: Jun 2010 Location: Dallas, TX Posts: 932	A lot of people do feel more comfortable buying a dog with papers instead of an identical dog without papers. Probably not the type of folks that you deal with as a reputable breeder, but I'm referring to the general public. If you look in a newspaper at backyard breeder ads, you'll see as many as possible list "AKC registered" right in the ad because they know it's a selling point despite the fact that no one buying one of their puppies actually needs those papers for anything. I'm not disagreeing that your dogs are better than mutts. You obviously care. But you said right in your post that most breeders don't. You know this and I know this but the general public doesn't. We see this almost every time someone comes to this forum looking for a puppy. The majority of breeders are bad, therefore the majority of purebred dogs are a crap-shoot. No not yours, and no not all, but a whole lot of them. The welfare of dogs would improve leaps and bounds if society as a whole accepted that you're not getting a guaranteed better dog than a mutt when you buy from an average breeder. __________________ Mom to Anabelle and Lila, rescued ladies and Harley, Corgi/Beagle/Basset/?? mutt "Saving just one dog won't change the world, but it surely will change the world for that one dog." - Richard C. Call

02-10-2011, 11:48 AM	#2 (permalink)
SophieB Senior Member Join Date: Oct 2008 Posts: 838	I don't think Bassets came over half as badly as King Charles Spaniels, Pugs and Boxers!

02-10-2011, 09:45 PM	#5 (permalink)
bubbad Senior Member Join Date: Jul 2004 Location: Boiling Springs,Pa Posts: 1,347	No wonder the Springbatt people were on their high horse about "Pedigreed Dogs". I prefer purebreds ,myself

02-10-2011, 10:43 PM	#6 (permalink)
mhvonalmen8908 Senior Member Join Date: Oct 2010 Location: Sumter, SC Posts: 671	I just read both the articles you linked Soundtrack. It just blows my mind about how the "documentary" apparently misrepresented the breeds and took quotes out of context. I'm going to see if I can find the actual "documentary" online and watch it. And I don't think Bassets are all that different from the olden days. But the sloping hindquarters of the German Shepards is a bit disconcerting to look at. It looks like they're scared all the time. To me anyway.

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